No Bull, No Fluff, No Smudges
Your news source for
Flagler, Florida and Beyond

Trump’s Middle Finger to Muslims, and Law

| January 29, 2017

President Trump, ex-casino mogul, is gambling with America's liberties. (© FlaglerLive)

President Trump, ex-casino mogul, is gambling with America’s liberties. (© FlaglerLive)

If there ever was a time to ask What Would Jesus Do, this is it. But Jesus’s head would explode, and not from the belt of a suicide bomber. From some of his own Christian worshippers-turned-jihadists.  

pierre tristam column flaglerlive In the wake of President Trump’s executive order banning refugees and potentially hundreds of thousands  of immigrants, including certain Green Card holders, from entering the U.S., the reaction from decent Americans should shock. Scenes of protesters outside of airport terminals where people were detained should have been unrecognizable as the America we know. But I haven’t recognized it for a while now, ever since a reality TV buffoon with dictatorial aspirations could be taken seriously enough by so much as a third of the country as to become a viable candidate for the leadership of the free world. That was back in June 2015, when we still had a chance to keep the nation out of the loony bin.

We didn’t. His popularity grew just enough, for just enough time, to get him elected. Now we’re paying the price. The Trump administration had manufactured a catastrophic week before Friday’s executive order. Friday’s order foisted a whole new order of shame. The order was expected. The infamy of its execution, on Muslim’s most important day of prayer no less, was not: the detention of travelers at airports on American soil, the removal of travelers from planes, the ban on even Green Card holders—students, professionals, families, children—from returning home, home being, they thought, the United States, all in haphazard ways, the stringency applying in some places but not in others, the cruelty and absurdity evident wherever the new rules were enforced. [Update: late Sunday, Trump retreated on Green Card holders, allowing them in.]

This is not who we are. This is not what we ought to be. But this is what we have become: a nation of fearful cowards with a moral compass closer to the toilets of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard than to the ideals of Ellis and Liberty Islands. It’s no small detail to note that Iran has no such ban. Not even on Jews, whom some of its more rabid turbans want to wipe off the face of the earth. But we now have bans on Iranians (not just Muslim Iranians, but even Zoroastrians), on Muslims and, outrageously, on thousands of our own permanent, legal residents. It’s a matter of time before other nations retaliate: so they should.

A visceral reaction to Trump’s order was inevitable (from both sides). Fortunately, the reaction was largely condemnation, not applause, and the ACLU’s heroic intervention—nothing new for the ACLU—managed to temporarily stay parts of the order, though the effect of that stay are restricted to detained travelers on U.S. soil. And those travelers are still not allowed to enter the country. They are only spared having to return from where they came. So they are all re-apparitions of Ignatz Mezei, the Gibraltar-born cabinet maker who spent 25 years building cabinets in Buffalo, then was imprisoned in 1950 for three years without charge, as a stateless national on his return from trying to see his mother in Rumania, on mere suspicions that he had communist sympathies. He was finally released in 1953 and allowed to go back to Buffalo. 

No one can blame today’s prisoners if some realize their home is no longer what they’d assumed it was, and they decide to leave. The more bigoted among us will cheer. Most of us will not, because the order’s contagion affects a lot more than those travelers or even those stranded abroad. It affects us all: it is as local as local gets. It is about who we are. It is also about what concerns us every day in our own communities. It is about the meaning of safety and security, the meaning of the Constitution, and even the meaning of that Pledge so many of you unthinkingly recite at the beginning of school or public and civic meetings: that we would in any way accept Trump’s order shows how meaningless those recitations are. It is also about the meaning of compassion, but let’s not let that exiled ideal divert from more clear and imminent dangers to the nation. No, not terrorists: Trump. His executive order rings the alarm.

Here’s why, point by point. (Fair warning: Alternative-fact faithfuls are kindly asked to leave the page if they find facts, evidence, context and history disturbing.)

The order is illogical, but a boon to the Trump Organization: It targets people in seven countries—Somalia, Sudan, Yemen, Libya, Syria, Iraq and Iran. It invokes the attacks of 9/11 as a rationale. Yet it exempts the nations most connected to 9/11 or to terrorism since, to terrorism financing, terrorist-recruitment and training, or nationals and actual terrorists who carry out attacks: Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Egypt, the United Arab Emirates, Lebanon and Turkey. Add the more recent hothouses of terrorist recruitment and nationals who carry out attacks, and you’d have to add Brussels, Paris and Port St. Lucie, Fla. Trump’s order does not appear to restrict travel from St. Lucie County, even to Orlando. Many of the countries the order does not affect, among them Saudi Arabia and the UAE, are countries where the Trump Organization or members of its cabinet have deeply lucrative business interests. Saudi Arabia as a business partner appears to concern Trump almost as little as does Russia, though the Saudis are the chief sponsor of terrorism and chief financier or al-Qaeda, ISIS and the Taliban. (In fairness, none of his predecessors have had those qualms, either, though only the Bush family had similarly direct business ties the Saudis.)

The Order is bigoted against Muslims: Trump’s claim that his executive order does not target Muslims is as believable as his lie at CIA headquarters last week that he’d never targeted the intelligence community, after likening that community to “Nazis” just days before. The order doesn’t target Christians, Hindus, Shinto, Wiccans or Branch Davidians. It targets Muslims and Muslim countries. It is bigoted in aim and execution, particularly as it also aims to give preferential treatment to Christians, though that provision is one of many that expose the order’s revealing sloppiness. To wit:

Projecting a nation in the grip of fear and cowardice.

The order is absurdly contradictory: Once refugees are to start being re-admitted into the United States, the Department of State has been ordered to “prioritize refugee claims made by individuals on the basis of religious-based persecution, provided that the religion of the individual is a minority religion in the individual’s country of nationality.” That means every brand of Islam must be allowed into the United States: Sunnis are a minority in Iraq, Iran, Lebanon and Bahrain (where the Sunni minority monarchy rules with an iron fist, American weaponry, and the U.S. Fifth Fleet headquartered in its waters). Kurds (whose Kurdistan Workers Party is on the State Department’s list of Foreign Terrorist Organizations) are a minority in Iraq, Iran, Turkey and Lebanon. Sunnis, Shiites and Druze are all minorities in Lebanon, where there is no single majority (Shiites have a plurality), and where each of these minorities can easily claim to have been the target of religious-based persecution. Shiites in the UAE, Kuwait, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia are minorities and are routinely targeted by the Sunni governments there. Shiites are important minorities in every North African country, and are to those countries’ prisons what blacks are to ours: disproportionate tenants. The list can go on: there is no such thing as a monolithic “Muslim” world anymore than there is such a thing as a single definition of “American,” “media,” or “Christian.” But Trump, who does not read books, seems unaware of an Islam more complicated than a cartoon of his own doodling.

The order re-institutes McCarthy-era ideological tests: “The United States must ensure that those admitted to this country do not bear hostile attitudes toward it and its founding principles,” the order states, which implies that Muslims, bearing the brunt of the ban, are therefore an inherent threat to America’s founding principles. It’s astounding that we’re at the point where we have to even defend against such statements. But here we are, however demonstrably false the assumption is. (American Muslims, only half of whom are native-born, are generally a mirror of the American economic mainstream as business owners, job creators and professionals). Let’s leave silent for now the part of the pussy-grabber’s order that claims to seek to protect Americans from people inclined to violence against women. The revival of ideological tests to enter the country  is a McCarthyist retread of far broader consequence, reflecting this administration’s attitude not only against the world (UN Ambassador Nikki Haley’s “we’re taking names”) but against Americans who are not in line with its edict (Chief Strategist Steve Bannon’s snarl to media to “keep its mouth shut”). The U.S. Supreme Court spent the 1960s cleaning up the rampant and, as it turned out, useless and discredited abuses of the McCarthy era. Trump either did not get the memo or thinks he can rewrite it with the legally intellectual depth of a tweet. Friday, he did.

 The order is alienating to allies: Without Iraq, the war against ISIS is unwinnable. American troops are assisting Iraq, whose own troops are the front-line warriors in an ongoing campaign to retake Mosul from ISIS, and go from there. The United States spent well over $1 trillion and lost 4,500 soldiers’ lives (not counting American contractors and mercenaries) in a war to “liberate” Iraq. To ban its nationals from American entry is to consider it an enemy even as it is being used as a battlefront ally. Iraqis will not take the contradiction quietly.

The order is a terrorist recruitment marketer’s dream: The order is titled “Protecting the Nation From Foreign Terrorist Entry Into the United States,” a title clearly inspired by the lyricism of USA Patriot days (originality is not a Trump forte). If protection is the intent, it will have the opposite effect. It sends the most explicit message since the wars on Afghanistan and Iraq that the United States is at war with Islam. The wars on Iraq and Afghanistan spawned a new, more numerous and more cruel generation of terrorists (even Al-Qaeda has distanced itself from ISIS). Trump’s order reinforces the perception—and now, the fact—that he does not distinguish between Muslims and terrorists, and indeed sees the two as synonymous, a slur on 1 billion Muslims, whatever their sectarian stripes. Terrorist recruiters thrive on portraying themselves as defenders of a faith under siege. They have been mostly wrong, though their enemies are primarily fellow-Muslims, who, unlike Trump, know the difference between a Muslim and a murderer. Trump is now an ISIS marketer’s ally, turning invented fears into demonstrable fact and making recruiters’ job once again as easy as it was when American forces occupied Iraq.

Click On:

The order has nothing to do with a terrorist threat to the United States: Not a single admitted Syrian refugee has been connected with a terrorist attack in the United States. Not a single admitted refugee from any of the countries Trump targeted has been associated with a terrorist attack on the United States. Not a single child refugee from any of 51 countries with Muslim majorities or pluralities has ever been associated with a terrorist attack on the United States. That’s because to gain entry to the United States, refugees are vetted more deeply than, to pick one familiar example, Trump was before becoming president. More to the point: terrorism is not a problem in the United States (or even in Europe). It is an extremely rare if spectacular and reprehensible occurrence, but it is dwarfed by the ongoing domestic terrorism that affects Americans’ lives every day. Charles Kurzman, a sociology professor at the University of North Carolina, publishes an annual study of “Muslim-American Involvement with Extremism.” By his count, as the Times reports this morning, “123 people have been killed in the United States by Muslim terrorists since the 2001 attacks — out of a total of more than 230,000 killings, by gang members, drug dealers, angry spouses, white supremacists, psychopaths, drunks and people of every description. So the order addresses, at most, one-1,870th of the problem of lethal violence in America. If the toll of Sept. 11 is included, jihadists still account for just over 1 percent of killings. ‘My advice to the new administration would be to declare victory,’ Mr. Kurzman said. For the average American, he added, ‘your odds of being victimized by a terrorist attack are infinitesimal.’” But that’s solid evidence. Trump does not operate on the basis of evidence but fear and expediency, without which he could not keep hold of the now-barely one-third of Americans who still approve of Hugo Chavez shrine he calls a presidency.

The order is unconstitutional: To make this point will sound a little queer after a year and a half of hearing Trump speak as if the Constitution were either an optional document or something he alone will interpret according to whatever judicial opinions can fit in his 140-characters. But it’s worth noting: We’re not a country of religious tests. We’re not a country that considers due process arbitrary. For that matter we’re not a country that considers arbitrary edicts permissible. (Obama heard calls of impeachment from Republicans when he signed his executive orders. Trump hears heavy breathing.) The First Amendment forbids religious tests. Trump’s order is predicated on a religious test. The 5th and 14th Amendment require due process. Trump’s order ignores it. Yes, refugees and many immigrants are not citizens and are not covered by the Constitution. But the administration of immigration policies and rules falls under constitutional requirements, and Green Card holders are as protected by the Constitution as citizens are. Circuit Judge Ann Donnelly is getting raves for staying at least parts of the Trump executive order. But it’s difficult to imagine any judge not ruling as she did: the Trump executive order appears not to have been written by seasoned or serious lawyers but by campaign hacks who think national security policy is still no different than ribeye applause lines to the Supreme Leader’s mob. The style of Kellyanne Conway, who is, after all, the president’s counselor, comes to mind.

For all this, there has been near-monolithic silence from Republicans about the order. A few have spoken out, not exactly against it—none is calling it bigoted, unnecessary, shameful, un-American, though it is all of that—but to call it overly broad. The rest are complicit in silence. It’s a familiar mode for them. They were silent when Trump framed his rise to relevance with the Obama birther myth, so rich in bigoted appeals to Muslim and foreign-born prejudices. They were silent when he lied about a federal judge’s nationality to discredit him, again on a smear of bigotry. They were silent when he lied about an opponent’s father’s association with JFK’s assassin. They were silent when he compared the intelligence community to Hitler’s Germany. They were silent when, on Dec. 7, 2015, he called for a total ban on Muslims entering the country, before he later muddied up the promise so he could get elected.

We know what recklessness and infamy to expect from Trump. It’s no different today than when he was a sleaze in Manhattan’s bonfire-of-the-vanities gossip scene in the 1980s. He delivered then. He’s delivering now. We have a right to expect better from the reigning party in an entire branch of government. True, it hasn’t delivered in years, and maybe that’s the problem: Trump wouldn’t be where he is had Republicans been more like statesmen and policymakers than shills. But checks and balances aren’t synonymous with blind collaboration, unless congressional Republicans are taking their cues from what their own legions so often referred to as “surrender monkeys.”

It seems they are. If Washington is unrecognizable, it is because it is increasingly bearing resemblance to Vichy France.

Pierre Tristam is FlaglerLive’s editor. Reach him by email here or follow him @PierreTristam.

48 Responses for “Trump’s Middle Finger to Muslims, and Law”

  1. My2Centz says:

    Someone with common sense HAD to say it! It was not unlikely that it’s Pierre Tristam. Such a SAD time for America……..SMH

  2. DRedder says:

    I would point out historically, that U.S. Code Law 1182, passed in 1952 by a Democratic House and Senate said the President of the United States has authority to bar immigrants from any country, regardless of race or religion if he believes they represent a threat to the United States…

    “This was used by President Jimmy Carter to ban Iranians from coming here and was used to deport several thousand Iranian students (after the Hostage taking). … When people call Trump a nut-case for saying ‘no more Muslims until we figure this out’ he stands on law.”

  3. Carolyn Buford says:

    This is not true. You need to read the executive action issued by Trump. This is a temporary ban to get the proper extreme vetting set up properly to protect the USA. I have been banned from certain places in the past for a temporary timeframe. It is OK and is not religious. There are Christians, Muslims and other religions in these countries. The issues and actions he campaigned on are the exact things he is doing for all Americans. He is your president. Have some respect. You can disagree with his approach or the fact that he won but he did win. You do not need to be hateful. The people of the USA voted him President of the USA for a reason.

  4. Percy's mother says:

    When I came to this country as an immigrant, I followed THE LAW.
    I came in on a quota.
    I went through the required medical testing.
    I did not receive any handouts, financial or otherwise. It was sink or swim, and still is.
    I did not receive any special treatment.
    I filled out the required government paperwork and jumped through all the hoops required by the Immigration and Naturalization Service.
    I followed THE LAW of the United States of America. I became a citizen legally. Because its THE LAW. Because a country must maintain its borders.

    Don’t write or tell me anything about immigration. I’ve been through it. I did it the right way. I received no help from anyone. I didn’t EXPECT any help from anyone. I worked my fingers to the bone and have made a somewhat decent life for myself. I managed to get a bachelors, masters and doctorate AND I paid back my student loans in 6 years without bemoaning my fate about the student loans. I expect that every immigrant would do the same. No more. No less. Regardless of nationality. I’m sick and tired of all the bellyaching about certain nationalities and their plight. I’ve been there and done it without all the continual articles like the one written here.

  5. JasonB says:

    Great piece, but it likely won’t do any good, facts are not Trump’s, or his mindless followers, strong point.

  6. Disgusted and Reviled says:

    This sickens me on so many levels…and I continued to be appalled at the lack of awareness of the trumpers…that seem to think all of this is just fine and dandy…God help us. We will all go down..not just the idiots that voted for this vile creature and his spawn and his billionaire cabinet. I bet every one of them has ‘safety’ places set up when the S**t hits the fan…and sux to be us who is left behind. OMG..and this is just the beginning.

    It also greatly concerns me that while this was all coming down last night, there was very little live news media coverage…MSNBC was about the only one. Even the rabid Fox couldn’t be found reporting what was happening at airports across our country. If it hadn’t been for on the spot IPhone coverage of what was happening…many people would have not known at all. THAT is very worrisome indeed.

  7. woodchuck says:

    Hey Peeair,slow down you are going to over heat your keyboard.

  8. Brian says:

    Hello Pierre – I hear that MSNBC is looking for an anchor to join their current staff of left-wing malcontent shills. You’d fit in great there; you and Rachel Maddow would be a merry duo – like a pile-up on the freeway: you don’t want to look but you just can’t help it. . . and some fresh goofiness from a true Christian-hater could probably boost their viewer-ship from 500 to 1000 !

    • Pierre Tristam says:

      Brian, as one of our most frequent commenters in FlaglerLive (and you have stiff competition) I wouldn’t want to disappoint you. You clearly love us too much, though we could do with a little less clinging. And you know by now that MSNBC is a bit too conventionally provincial for me.

  9. Katie Semore says:

    Stupid is as stupid does, and it doesn’t come any more stupid than Trump and his tiny hands.

  10. Veteran says:

    He is following existing law, not made by him. We don’t need an influx of immigrants. There are 95 million people out of work! We’ve had enough killings by Islamic terrorists. Let’s take of our homeless Americans and veterans.

  11. Richard Smith says:

    Do you think that Trump would now be POTUS if the people running our government on both sides of the aisle had done their jobs in the last 3 decades instead of doing NOTHING?

    I along with millions of others in this country have said that it is time for a change and Hillary was just more of the same. PUKE! Now the cesspool will be drained of the useless do nothings and now the country will be run by a business man instead of corrupt bureaucratic politicians who catered to the lobbyist instead of doing what the American people wanted done.

    You have every right to state your opinions and facts in your articles but it is getting old and repetitious so I won’t be reading anymore of your crap.

    I can just imagine what your articles would have been like if crooked corrupt Hillary had won the election.

  12. Pierre Tristam says:

    Without watching or hearing a minute’s worth of Fox or the radio shout shows we can very quickly tell what talking points their propagandists are putting out because we immediately get those echoes here in the comments or in the more effluent-rich gutters on Facebook, where Trump defenders can generally be relied on never to have an original thought, though they’ve mastered the art of ctr-alt-c and ctrl-alt-v (they have an amazing facility with anything doused in alt). The talking points making the rounds in response to Trump’s ban seems t be that this is really an Obama idea (don’t ask), that the ban never mentions Muslims (true, and it doesn’t tell refugees to go fuck themselves–to quote our own Supreme Leader in another context)–but we get the idea), and that it’s all perfectly within the law (never mind that within hours the first federal judge to get her hands on it started the shredding of the order. Give it time and we’ll soon be told that Obama, being Muslim and a terrorist sympathizer, was really trying to save the country from himself. It’s that sort of surreal universe we’re now living in. Rome’s sophists had nothing on Fox’s. Woodchuck, Trump is only getting started. So am I.

  13. PeachesMcGee says:

    @ Percy’s Mother

    I applaud you on your citizenship. This country is founded on immigration, provided it’s done correctly.

  14. r&r says:

    If you remember WW@ when Japan bombed Pearl Harbor the Japan people in the the USA were put into camps and confined. There was also a ban allowing Germans from coming into the USA. That was to make sure we would not be attached from within. That’s what Trump is doing, trying to protect us. Let him do his job and get off his back.

  15. PCer says:

    Thank you Pierre.

  16. Jim R says:

    I Am not shocked that a third of the country would support a lying dangerous buffoon like trump.
    considering that they can go about their business without a thought or sorrow or guilt for all the death and destruction we have caused in the middle east.
    As Chalmers Johnson warned in his book Nemesis we are going to pay for our Empires Crimes, it’s called Karma,

    “Her name is Nemesis and she just moved in,
    She’s new to the neighborhood, she’s checking it out” John Shreffler

  17. Reinhold Schlieper says:

    Germany has admitted about 1 million refugees (about 1 percent of total population). There have been three attacks: one person blew himself up at being rejected for asylum; no one else was hurt. Another, an Afghani, attacked with an axe some folks in a train. And the final truck attack in Berlin was done by a Tunisian who had his deportation papers on him in the truck and had already been classified as criminal in Tunisia before he had come to Europe. No Syrian refugee has attempted anything there to the best of my knowledge–other than the culture clashes that one should have expected. And, yes, Tristam is perfectly correct in analyzing various Muslim faiths as minority religions. I know that a Druze of my acquaintance in Saudi Arabia lamented that Saudis did not accept him as a Muslim. Thank you for being right on again, Pierre Tristam! What worries me most about Trump now is that he is ignoring the judicial branch; such is the route to totalitarianism.

  18. Pay attention says:

    Obama also did this in 2011.. Check facts. Flagler live. And when Obama did this no one said a thing… Trump is doing this legally and for the safety of our United States of America! God Bless.

  19. Resident says:

    More anti Trump drivel.

  20. OMG says:

    And Bill Clinton got a standing ovation when touting the very same policies…. GET A REAL

  21. Anonymous says:

    You hood sit should be sent packing with the rest of them

  22. Knightwatch says:

    Today the Republican-only president truly embarrassed America before the entire world. His repugnant racist and xenophobic beliefs prove him wholly unfit to lead this once great country. And equally vile is the Republican congress’s cesspool of weak, gutless, fawning martinets who can no longer deny their own collective racism and xenophobia. They disgust me, most Americans and all the world’s true democracies.

  23. Leslie Yazurlo says:

    I’m getting so sick and tired of people telling me that he is our president and to respect him and when I respond by saying, “No”, I’m called names that even I don’t like to say and I’ll say just about any word out there. There’s a BIG difference between respect our president and respecting the office of the president. I respect the office but I DON’T respect the man in the office! He doesn’t even respect the office!! First of all this man is the perfect example of what a president shouldn’t look or ACT like. He embodies hate and bigotry and total disrespect for women. A president is supposed to bring Americans together not to further rip them apart as Trump is doing. I can not and will not respect this man because there is nothing to respect and if I were to support him then it means I’m ok with hating anyone because of their race, color, religion, gender and country they come from and I’m NOT!!

  24. JasonB says:

    “Pay attention says: Obama also did this in 2011.. Check facts. Flagler live. And when Obama did this no one said a thing”

    I did check the facts, and no surprise, you are wrong on all most every point.

    First, Obama responded to an actual threat—the discovery that two Iraqi refugees has been implicated in bomb-making in Iraq that had targeted U.S. troops.

    Second, Obama did not announce there was a ban on visa applications.

    Third, Obama’s policy did not prevent all citizens of that country, including green-card holders, from traveling the United States.

    Fourth, there was a lot of critical news reporting at the time about the angst of Iraqis waiting for approval.

    Darn those facts …

  25. Disgusted and Reviled says:

    Respect isn’t elected. It’s earned. And money doesn’t buy class.

  26. Fredrick says:

    Pierre just as you complain the responses you disagree with are just talking points from the other side, where in the hell do you think yours come from? …. Maybe the truth is somewhere in the center. Maybe it’s not quite as bad as your side is saying… Maybe it’s just a wee little bit being blown out of proportion to provide your side talking points? Maybe? just a little? You do realize that this blowing crap out of proportion is what got Trump elected. These continued political games is what people are tired of. Yes the buffoon is going to make a lot of stupid decisions and more ridicules tweets, but this what the last 8 years did to this country. Suck it up.. Your side brought this on. Trump is not liked by republicans or democrats. He is liked by people who are tired of the way the country was being taken and they are tired of being called a racist, homophobe, woman haters just because they are tired of the “political elite” (I just prefer to call them morons) on both sides. You put up a worse candidate who would have given us more of the same. Your sides message and path it was headed down was rejected by not just losing the presidency but all the losses at all levels of government. So here we are…. WE have OUR president.

  27. Fredrick says:

    Leslie… those that said Obama was “Not their President” were call racists… by his supporters. So you may have to put up with being called a few names…. get used to it or revoke your citizenship. If your an American he is your President just as Obama was mine for the last 8 years.

  28. Steve Robinson says:

    This “administration” is embarking on a crusade (and I use that word quite deliberately) against people of color. Anyone who thinks otherwise is simply not paying attention. Whether it be Mexicans rounded up and deported, Muslims yanked off planes, or blacks denied their right to vote by a Justice Department stripped of its civil rights division, it is clear that Bannon and Flynn, not to mention Putin, have found their useful idiot in this carnival barker who occupies the White House.

  29. Anonymous says:

    Saying Fox broadcast talking points is a joke, they have a point of view and some people agree. It’s no different than those that agree with the liberal media – Huffigton Post , MSNBC, Richard Moore, Stephan Colbert, Pierre Tristam, CNN, NBC, ABC. You can watch Fox and see that not everyone on that network agrees with what Trump is doing, Pieerre has disagreed with Obama on a few things, mostly not being more left than he was. Keep in mind Obama ranked the most liberal Senator based on his voting record, I will say I watch all the news outlets and the reporting is so different and they all cover polics in a very biased manner.
    Our kids are screwed, we have become a very confusing society where adults act like imbeciles.

  30. Ben Hogarth says:

    I met one of the last remaining former child Hitler-youth Germans living in the world. He lives here in the States and he has a noble heart. When mention of Hitler and Trump he could only sigh. He clearly is no fan of Trump and believes we are making a similar mistake.

    How so many people can believe that Islam as a religion and all those who practice it represent a threat to this nation is beyond me. There are plenty of orthodox Christian Russians more than willing to harm the legitimacy of our very democracy. There are more than enough pseudo Christians in this nation who act out violently because other men and women do not share their same radical ideologies.

    And here we are, with an internal group of right-wing Christian radicals hoping to subjugate non-christians and the only people standing in their way are true Christian’s trying to protect the innocent.

    If you “Christians” want to play THAT game, what would you say to this Roman Catholic if he calls your brand of Christianity “fake” because it does not fall in line with the Catholic Church (Christs church). Surely we could easily establish lines in the sand among each other that way as well. Certainly you could be discriminated upon for not being a “true Christian.” Why go back only 50 years when we can go back 500 to the days of Catholic Inquisitions!

    Ahh… that’s not fair is it? Perhaps then you should retract ignorant statements then. True sons and daughters of liberty would never support this President in his bold attempt at creating a public emergency so he can usurp power. But we are all too busy bickering over religion and being “right” that we forget we have a man trying to establish himself a king! Or worse…

  31. AL says:

    @Pay attention, you should indeed pay attention.

    Trump’s claim that Obama took the same action in 2011 is not true.

    “So what’s the difference with Trump’s action?

    First, Obama responded to an actual threat – the discovery that two Iraqi refugees has been implicated in bomb-making in Iraq that had targeted U.S. troops. Under congressional pressure, officials decided to reexamine all previous refugees and also impose new screening procedures, which led to a slowdown in processing new applications. Trump, by contrast, issued his executive order without any known triggering threat.

    Second, Obama did not announce there was a ban on visa applications. In fact, as seen in Napolitano’s answer to Collins, administration officials danced around that question. There was certainly a lot of news reporting that visa applications had been slowed to a trickle. But the Obama administration never said it was their policy to halt all applications. Even so, the delays did not go unnoticed, so there was a lot of critical news reporting at the time about the angst of Iraqis waiting for approval.

    Third, Obama’s policy did not prevent all citizens of that country, including green-card holders, from traveling the United States. Trump’s policy is much more sweeping.”

  32. footballen says:

    If the same could be said for Christians then the Christian network of people would ban together and surgically remove the radical nut jobs as they did when a few went insane and killed people with bombs over abortion clinics. After those EIGHT people were killed other Christians ensured that the whack jobs were either jailed or incarcerated for their obvious mental health issues. I am sorry for the woes of the Muslim community, I truly am; however at the end of the day I don’t want my loved ones exposed to some crazy Jihadist no matter how much that offends a person!!!!!!

  33. footballen says:

    BTW Leslie you say a President is supposed to be bringing a country together and in the same sentence shout you despise him. The country is coming together you just refused to get on the bus because someone told you some lies and you believe them.

  34. Gkimp says:

    Funny! Liberals NOW want to follow the law?

  35. Sherry says:

    @Carolyn Buford. . . let me remind you and others once again. . . the Majority of citizens did NOT vote for Trump! He will never be my president!
    This article is not hateful. However it is factual. Do some research on your own. Look up how many citizens from the banned countries have committed acts of terrorism in the USA. Now look up the countries where those terrorists came from. For example, several of the 911 attackers were from Saudi Arabia. Why isn’t Trump banning people from there? Because he has business there that makes him millions of dollars per year!

    He has very clear “conflicts of interest” which at best creates corruption in his decision making and may even be unconstitutional and therefore completely illegal.

    Should YOUR president be above the law? A lawsuit has already been filed against him for this! We taxpayers will be paying for his legal battles because of his actions, or lack of actions. Shouldn’t our hard earned tax dollars be spent on things like education?

    Trump’s counselor, Steve Bannon, is strongly connected to white supremacists groups. Is this really the kind of person you want influencing YOUR president?

    I could go on and on! Since you obviously voted for Trump. . . you should be rethinking your misguided loyalties. Read the comments from his fear and hate filled rabid supporters here. Do you really want to be associated with those people? If so, you are terribly lost and I have compassion for you.

  36. Disgusted and Reviled says:

    You must be talking about Alternative Facts! know..those things that float around aimlessly in the R’s alternative reality!

  37. #Bernie2020 says:

    Trump’s days are numbered, Impeachment is coming and I hope they do the same for Pence.

    #Alternativefacts being told as usual by Trump Supporters.

    Real Fact 1

    Calls to ban Muslims from entering the U.S. are offensive and unconstitutional.
    Governor Mike Pence @GovPenceIN
    10:30 AM – 8 Dec 2015

    His comment was in response to a 7 December 2015 proposal by then-presidential candidate Donald Trump to institute a temporary ban on Muslims entering the country until government officials could “figure out what’s going on.”

    Obama administration officials said that there never was a point when Iraqi resettlement was stopped or banned. Iraqi refugee processing was lowed, in response to a specific threat, was it was not halted. The Trump White House, meanwhile, has failed to provide any evidence for its statement.

  38. Fredrick says:

    Pierre I am sure you will hate the source of this and you will call it “talking points” but read this with an open mind and ……..perhaps the truth is in the middle somewhere. The melt down and blowing out of proportion of what is going on is inciting the divide. Those are the people with using the “talking points” to justify their fake outrage or ignorance.

  39. #Bernie2020 says:

    There are 95 million people out of work!

    #Alternativefacts being told as usual by Trump Supporters. Do Trump Supporters have a fact blocker on their Google Searches?

    Real Fact 2

    All Americans 16 years old and up: 253.9 million
    Americans in the labor force with a job: 152.1 million
    Americans in the labor force without a job: 8.0 million

    That leaves 93.8 million Americans not in the labor force. But a lot of them are not in the labor force for understandable reasons.

    44.0 million are retired.

    15.3 million are disabled.

    13.3 million are taking care of a family member.

    13.2 million are in college or job training.

  40. r&r says:

    He was voted in by the majority and while he was running he told the country if elected this is what he was going to do. SO WHAT’S THE SURPRISE AND THESE PROTEST ALL ABOUT?????????????????????????

  41. Common Sense says:

    The ban is nothing but a sop to his uneducated supporters. Note the following:

    None, not one of the countries on the list have exported terrorists to the US or have been responsible for any attacks on the US.

    On the other hand, not a single Muslim country, where Trump has business interests, is included in the list.
    Specifically, Saudi, where most of the 9/11 terrorists came from.

    The ban is so broad that it includes Christians from those countries, even if they are being persecuted.

    R. Guiliani was the architect of the ban. Do you recall voting for him, in any capacity that would allow them to make foreign policy for the US? The answer is no we didn’t. What foreign policy experience does he have? Has he been briefed by any intelligence agency? No. So what exactly qualifies him for being the architect of the ban, other than being a Trump groupie and a serial cheater?

  42. This is a snowflake Flurry says:

    The man did not campaign to win a popularity contest. He Ran for President and WON. He is the President of the United States and his goal is to reset the standard of National security, while strong-arming corporations to quit this tax haven Bullshit in Ireland and Caymen islands, avoiding taxes etc… . He said he was going to do it, and the Nation voted towards that agenda. He is not out playing Golf Today. Tomorrow he is also not out playing golf. Please tune into the Whitehouse website, you will see what he does all day, he is calling every Sheik, prince and king in Mesopotamia (Middle East) conversing with the leaders out in that Quagmire that are stable countries with US relations, and also want to END Islamic Terrorism, and provide a safe zone, within the country that these refugees come from so they can be safe and have necessities, without the arduous journey to other countries. I am proud that we gave this guy a chance, and for once, we are getting exactly what it is that we have voted for. And may I remind you its been only 10 days in???

  43. Sw says:

    All I see is a more divided USA than ever and it is so needless….

  44. People need to relax says:

    I am a first generation American citizen. My father is a permanent resident alien (for over 55 years), and my mother became a citizen over 40 years ago. The immigration order that was just put in place, is a right by the president of this country in order to keep us safe. First of all it is for 3 months, until they can come up with what they feel is proper vetting or extend if needed or even add more countries if found necessary.. The areas listed are very unstable, proper documentation is hard to vet, and when their is a mass migration, unfortunately people with not the best intentions try to take advantage of cracks in the system.

    My dad just had an issue this past summer, he had been quite ill and didnt realize his green card had expired while on his trip abroad. he had gone to visit his 95 year old mother, when he tried to come back, he was held up at customs. He was not allowed to board the plane back to his home of 55 years. after a few hours of immigration doing what they do, him having to buy a return plane ticket back to his mother country ($$$), he was finally able to get on a plane back to the US. Mind you he is a very sick man, needs ton of medications, etc… Picture your typical senior sick grouch. But, once home he renewed his card, and all is well. Although an inconvenience, we did not protest, it was his fault, but it was not the end of the world. it shows our systems are set up and work. They are there for a reason. This country has the laws in place so as not to harm its citizens, whether it be because of jobs, safety, etc..
    Yes the order went into effect suddenly, so caused some incoveniences – but again, you dont warn the bad guys that you are locking the door.. 155 people were affected, again not the end of the world. The protesters caused more havoc to people that had nothing to do with what was going on..tons of flights lost, delays, etc..

    People need to try to fix the real problem, make the countries these people are fleeing from safe again for them to stay there. There a woman has NO rights. Can not drive, can not leave the house unchapperoned, its illegal to be gay, transgender, punishable by death..why dont the protesters fly over there and go cause some real change!!!
    My family immigrated here, they went through the process like everyone else. we love this country, we worked hard and achieved the American dream. We added our foods to the 4th of july bbq, but have no doubt we celebrate what every American does on that day, the country who many gave their lives for our freedom, and for the freedom of its citizens. We do have a right to protect ourselves,our borders, and our dream.
    I am proud to say that I voted for OUR president. Like me he is also a first generation American citizen. I feel like me he has lived the American dream, and feels that all Americans have the right to do so. This was always thought the land of opportunity because anyone who was lucky enough to come here knew they would be able to find a job, and with hard work would own something, be able to provide for their families, live their life to their fullest potential. Why did our factories leave? Why did things stop saying Made in America?
    Its time to get focused and get this country back together. We need to get our cities fixed..Chicago can not continue..heroin epidemic is out of control.. healthcare is ridiculous..
    Washington was not working..

  45. Lina says:

    Thank you, Pierre. Your truth of the issue must prevail. Just a note to the naysayers: Who do you think is behind the ban? President Bannon and his sidekick, VP Trump.

  46. Katie Semore says:

    The stupidity and hate-filled hearts of many Americans make my heart weep.

Leave a Reply

FlaglerLive's forum, as noted in our comment policy, is for debate and conversation that adds light and perspective to articles. Please be courteous, don't attack fellow-commenters or make personal attacks against individuals in stories, and try to stick to the subject. All comments are moderated.

Read FlaglerLive's Comment Policy | Subscribe to the Comment Feed rss flaglerlive comment feed rss

More stories on FlaglerLive

FlaglerLive Email Alerts

Enter your email address to get alerts.


support flaglerlive palm coast flagler county news pierre tristam
news service of florida
FlaglerLive is a non-profit 501(c)(3) organization | P.O. Box 254263, Palm Coast, FL 32135 | Contact the Editor by email | (386) 586-0257 | Sitemap | Log in