Is wearing a mask in public too much to ask for as Palm Coast and Flagler reopen? Does it infringe on individuals’ liberties? “Masks have now been a significant part of that dialogue as we move to reopening, and how that impacts those numbers,” Palm Coast Mayor Milissa Holland says of the next phase in the coronavirus emergency.
The issue took up a long portion of the weekly virtual town hall anchored by Holland on Wednesday. The answer from the experts on the panel–two physicians, the Flagler Health Department’s chief and Palm Coast’s fire chief–was an unequivocal No. (See: “How and When to Wear a Mask, and How Not To.”
And one physician went as far as proposing that local government should exercise its authority to write ordinances requiring the wearing of masks in certain public places, while a fire chief said shoppers should take matters in their own hand and pressure store owners or managers to institute and enforce mask-wearing rules.
“I understand the civil liberties point of view with it for sure,” said Dr. Vincent DeGennaro Jr., an epidemiologist, global health specialist and the chief executive officer at Abacus Pharma International in Miami. He’d called in by phone. “I think we sacrifice a lot of our civil liberties in many different ways.” He cited severe restrictions when flying, vaccine requirements for children in schools, the mandated wearing of seatbelts, prohibitions on drunk driving. “There’s a lot of things that would impinge on your ‘civil liberties’ in the name of public health. So I think there’s plenty of legal precedent. I don’t think it’s a slippery slope at all.”
The more important point, DeGennaro said of wearing masks, is that it reduces the transmission of the coronavirus. “You’re not wearing the mask for yourself. You’re wearing the mask for the people around you,” he said. “I just took what, three planes and two trains in the last week, and I feel very confident that I don’t have anything, because not only was I wearing a mask, but every other single person was wearing a mask. So it’s really going to drop the transmission rate. And most importantly, if we could come out of our holes, go back to work and restart the economy, and the only sacrifice we had to make is wear a mask and wash our hands, isn’t that a trade-off you’d make? I’d urge that if the county had this authority, to mandate masks in public settings where there’s going to be more than two people, be it a store and other things, because it’s not right that someone who is vulnerable has to risk their life to go shopping because someone else wants to be defiant. You could issue tickets just like you do with seat belts. Like I said, there’s plenty of legal precedent for this, and I think if we’re going to open up, we’re going to have some form of that.”
For now there is no taste among local officials to mandate the wearing of masks in public, and no taste among local law enforcement to enforce such an order, if it were in place. But DeGennaro’s proposal is not quite radical. On April 20, Connecticut enacted an order requiring all persons age 2 and older to wear masks when using public transportation and taxis, in public places where the six-foot separation can’t be maintained, and for customers and employees of essential businesses. Hawaii, Maryland, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania and Rhode Island all have similar rules, with variations.
But mask-wearing is becoming emblematic of the shift in the debate over Covid-19–from fighting the virus to arguing over freedoms as communities reopen. It’s easy for many to plaster slogans like “we’re in this together” on their Facebook page, but for some, it’s harder to translate that to action when it matters.
Protests by fringe groups aside, an overwhelming majority of Americans still favored stay-at-home orders in mid- to-late late April, and a poll this week has 70 percent of Americans wanting President Trump and Vice President Mike Pence wearing masks when they travel. Trump has consistently undermined his public health experts, refusing to wear a mask. Pence rarely does so. Another poll showed that 55 percent of Americans who left their home last week wore masks.
But minorities are using the wearing of masks–or the refusal to wear a ask–as a marker delimiting their personal freedoms and right to take what risks they choose, misconstruing the purpose and science behind the masks.
Dr. Stephen Bickel, the medical director at the Flagler and Volusia health departments, had been a skeptic on mask-wearing in the earlier weeks of the emergency. Like a convert, he’s now a pro-mask “fanatic,” he said Wednesday.
“Here are the reasons,” he said, framing his answer in his characteristic but accessible language of a science journal abstract: “A, if you look at the countries that have been highly successful combatting this, mostly in Asia, they’ve adopted near-universal mask wearing. I don’t think that’s an accident. Secondly, as we look to open up the community, which we know is necessary, there’s clearly a risk of this thing surging more, at least expanding to some degree. So we want to pick the least intrusive measures that we can adopt to prevent the spread, and mask wearing is very high on the list. There are models that have been constructed showing that if 60 percent of the people wear masks at any one moment, and the masks are 60 percent effective, that alone is enough to get the R0, which is the spread coefficient, down to 1, which is basically at that point the spread stops multiplying. It just stays level. Then you throw in any other measure and it’s additives. So it just seems to me, it’s kind of a slam dunk policy to adopt. You can’t force it on people, I understand that. We have our interest in civil liberties. But in terms of just promoting it and people realizing they’re doing this to support their community, to protect their fellow residents, I think it’s just something that we should embrace as a highly effective, minimally intrusive way to really keep this thing under control, an additive to all the other measures that we’re going to adopt.”
Bob Snyder, the director of the Flagler Health Department, said wearing masks locally should be universal, “especially for indoor public settings, like grocery stores, like restaurants, pharmacies.” It can be a surgical mask. It can also be “a bandana, a scarf, just any cloth material, something,” he said. “That this is a solid strategy for reducing the transmission of Covid-19.”
But local officials know the limitations they’re up against–the me-first attitude that prevails among certain groups.
“The reality of the situation is this,” Palm Coast Fire Chief Jerry Forte said. “People will do what they want, and everybody believes to a certain urgency what this Covid virus is. So if there’s a young individual who is healthy and they feel they don’t want to wear a mask, we are not going to force them to [wear] a mask. There’s no way we could do that. The actions of those not wearing a mask may be of little consequence to themselves, but [to] the vulnerable population in the city, it’s a very big deal.”
Those who are most vulnerable are 65 and over, and those who have an underlying condition: 84 percent of Florida’s more than 1,800 people killed by the virus are 65 and older.
Shoppers, Forte said, have “the ability to go to the proprietor of the store, the store manager, and urge them to change their culture and their behavior, allowing people to come in with a mask on. If we can’t push it from a legislative point of view, certainly the people that are going to these stores can urge these changes at the shopper’s level.”
Wednesday’s full Palm Coast Town Hall on Covid-19. The discussion about masks begins around minute 33.
Merrill S Shapiro says
Perhaps it’s ensconced in in our founding documents, but we’ve spent lots of time talking about rights, rights, rights and too little time talking about responsibilities, responsibilities, responsibilities! We have responsibilities to one another and to our neighbor’s health and well-being. Let’s live up to our responsibilites.
We only have responsibility to ourselves. We can not control what our neighbor is doing or how they react. We can only control our own actions. Why do we not start there. Controlling our own actions, instead of trying to control everyone else’s. If your neighbor is living an unhealthy lifestyle, how are you going to change that and why is it your responsibility?
I would disagree. Our laws are often about protecting the well being of others. Murder, drinking and driving, abuse, speeding, and others are examples of such. This is a lethal disease some may not know they have and can easily spread to others. We need to manage the health crisis and spread if we expect to correct the economic problem. You can’t fix the latter without managing the former.
I agree with personal responsibility.
Ron Stahr says
the actual study: https://www.acponline.org/acp-newsroom/denmark-trial-measures-effectiveness-of-adding-a-mask-recommendation-to-other-public-health-measures
Nancy N. says
Living like that isn’t “grit”, it’s narcissism.
Wearing a cloth mask doesn’t protect you…it protects other people. When you refuse to wear a mask, you send the message that you care more about your “freedom” to not wear a mask, than you do about the workers who must serve you to earn a living, and the vulnerable people in the community. You are literally saying…my right to breathe on you is more important than your right to live.
Try looking past the end of your own nose for once.
Willy Boy says
On the narcissistic side of the issue, wearing a mask improves the appearance of a considerable swath of the public.
Excuse me Nancy, but I respectfully disagree. I am not endangering vulnerable people by not wearing a mask. It is the other way around. If you are vulnerable you should be wearing the mask. It’s like after my transplant. I was wearing a mask following surgery for the first 4 weeks to protect myself, not the people around me.
Wrong, mask is to protect others not yourself. How would it even protect the person wearing it? That doesnt make sense. Catch your own vapor droplets to in your mask to protect others
PPE~ personal protection equipment . Protects both you and the entitled ndividuals foolish enough NOT to wear face covering.
If your neighbor lives an unhealthy lifestyle, it doesn’t affect your health. If your neighbor contracts Covid 19, they can affect everyone that they contact, who then spread it, if they are also irresponsible. In other words, an unmasked person could result in a local epidemic. It is illegal for an HIV positive person to have unprotected sex without first informing their partner. Why not the same for unmasked people who have or even don’t know they have Covid 19?
So by that logic does everybody have to have a test for HIV before they have sex to verify if they have the disease or not? Because by requiring everyone to wear a mask whether they have a disease or not is basically Saying that until proven otherwise you have a disease or illness, And at that point when does it stop? because once we get a vaccine for this coronavirus there’s gonna be another disease or virus or pollution in general, and who’s to say the governments not gonna require you to wear a mask for that purpose or goggles to protect your eyes, because you can get the disease by rubbing your eyes if it’s on your hands, Or earplugs because the virus can enter through your ears. I think the issue is more of government restrictions on individuals then to wear a mask or not, it’s just common sense and respect for one another to wear a mask and I absolutely agree with that I wear a mask every day. My issue is with government restricting my ability to decide for myself. And this debate is never going to end, everyone has their opinion and they’re entitled to it. For example the debate between pro-life and pro choice, look at the different variations and decisions on that and how long it’s been argued for both sides.
S mcguire says
Correct. Anything else is a violation of our civil liberties to force us to wear by the govt. A business we have a choice to follow the rules and work there. Govt has no business on demanding this. He that giveth up liberty for security – loses both. Such actions were tolerated for the”greater good” in Germany lest anyone forget. People are being selfish and dangerously arrogant to think everyone has to think like they do. A mask is only going to work if u are less than 6 ft apart and wearing a mask incorrectly is a joke. It is droplet not airborne people – meaning it isn’t suspended in the air. I recommend people read real science journals and not the news.
Firstly, droplets are airborne for a period of time. If you don’t believe me, step outside and check out our humidity or better yet, look at fog in your headlights. Those little particles are droplets. How long they are airborne depends on a number of factors whether you are indoors, and outdoors to a lesser extent. Arrogance is putting your “personal liberty” over the health and safety of our society. If I decide to drive drunk because it’s my choice, my personal liberty, I endanger not only myself, but also everyone I might contact. We all agree that this behavior is unacceptable to persons living in our society and penalize it. From wearing clothes in when you’re in public, not yelling fire in a crowded theater, to not driving down the interstate at 200 mph, there are things that we give up for the good of society. If living with your fellow men and women in a society infringes on your personal liberty, please feel free to buy yourself an island and run wild.
Can someone tell me the difference between a gun carrying person shooting people and virus carrying person killing people?
Dr. Know says
Mask…No Mask……. In the long run it really isn’t going to change the outcome. Which is EVERYONE WILL GET THE VIRUS and EVERYONE WILL CARRY IT IN THEIR BLOOD. And from what I’m learning, until a vaccine is created that will STOP 3200 different corona viruses strains, humans will just have to LIVE WITH IT !!!!!!
Humans will have to live with the challenge of viruses, because no matter the vaccine, its never going to be 100% effective. The current vaccines, supposedly containing the flu are only some 40% effective. And even at that level of effectiveness, there are still more people getting the flu – despite the vaccine – then there are getting Covid without a vaccine.
Steve Vanne says
Were doom, Dr know u believe our government we o sad…
Again, the panel of experts is suggestion a narrative without opposition to give people a guilt complex who oppose wearing a mask. Not wearing a mask can have many reasons, one is personal preference, another one is a medical condition that prevents people from safely wearing a mask, and also, disagreeing with the conclusion that mask wearing is making any sizeable difference. These “so called experts” have no more clue as to effectiveness then anyone else, because the scientific world is split on this subject. There is NO CLEAR EVIDENCE that wearing a mask is making any sizeable difference!!!!!!!! During the town hall meeting it has been implied that it is a clear scientific fact, but that is not true. There are as many doctors and experts disagreeing as agreeing. And since none of us has been in this situation before, I would love to see a bit more caution before making “matter of fact statements”. A key factor in protecting people’s health is to gain immunity to the covid virus. That will not happen by hiding away. To cite the Asian policies as an effective way to copy, because they are wearing their masks religiously is only telling half of the story. many Asian countries have far more pollution in their cities then we do. Far more people have health issues from pollution and are trying to protect against pollution much more than Covid. Again, presenting one factor in the wrong content does not make it a valid point. I myself am a transplant patient on heavy meds to suppress my immune system. However, over the past 20 years, I have been successful keeping myself healthy without ever getting the flu, or any other infection by strengthening my immune system. I will not compromise my successful application and history of staying healthy for the misguided information by a few. By-the-way, I also never had a flu shot.
Your freedom to choose comes to a screeching halt when the health and safety of others is adversely impacted.
No Bob, our freedom’s do not end where your “feelings” begin. Think abortion!
Nancy Miller says
Nancy N. says
You take those medications to suppress your immune system for a reason…trying to “strengthen” your immune system is completely counterproductive and just counteracts the medication’s benefits!
How immunosuppressiva works: It suppresses your immune system from recognizing a foreign organ and lowers your overall immunity to fight infections. However, strengthening your healthy immune responses to your environment has nothing to do with that. By strengthening my immune system in response to environmental factors, staying healthy, active and eating a healthy diet enabled me to fight off the flu and so far -thankfully- Covid 19. Keeping your immune system strong requires work and Disziplin, just like staying fit and healthy.
Ben Dover says
But what Grit doesn’t seem to understand is he could have the virus and not know it and be infecting others by not wearing a mask, just don’t understand why Trupsters can’t get that ,The only reason Trump doesn’t wear a mask is because he doesn’t want to smear his clown make up
Give me a break, none of the damn leaders wear masks, they’re laughing at you guys because you don’t know how to question and research facts, you’re only good at doing what your told , even if common sense when your masked youre obstructing airflow Nd oxygen.
My daughter has been wearing a mask and all the PPE since all this started and she got the virus. Do does all this really help? Who knows. Maybe Greta has the answers.
Trump sets the precedent for many people. Not me, because I think he’s dumber than a Dodo bird. But many people out there listen to him as an authority and follow his lead. His lead is to ignore the advice from his own task force and scream about liberating states from “oppressive” regimes. He screams about freedoms and violations, while some members of his own task force works now to undermine health officials and guidance for public safety. This has been a political stunt by Trump. He accuses Democrats of playing politics. What politician in their right mind would want the economy to tank? Hmm? That is ignorant and dumb. No one wants a desperate and potentially deadly populace at their wits end both financially and with their patience. The argument that Democrats are getting something out of this or are gleeful that this is happening shows that some people are just a few clicks shy from a marble farm in their brain. I am a conspiracy nut, love them, enjoy them, and frankly believe in some but there is a limit to what is viable and what is just plain insane. Trump has over 81,000+ deaths on him. He had the information in January. He ignored it. He continues to ignore the science and advisors. He continues to stoke the flames that burn bright in his soldiers, who are painfully loyal to a man that obviously doesn’t care if they live or die. The life and death of American’s is politics to Trump. All he cares about is making sure his supporters can chant xenophobic, racist, homophobic, and sexist chants while they carry their AK’s and scream in the faces of people that one day may just have to save their lives. All his supporters need to do is come up with their own hand salute to honor Trump and the cycle is complete.
Wearing a face covering has become just another political tool–wear one and your a scaredy-cat Dem, don’t wear one and you’re a tough Trumper. Has life really become that simple that we are playing Covid-roulette with each other? Face coverings do not infringe on your liberties or freedoms. Wearing one does not violate your constitutional rights. That is all lies trumped up by Trump and by Rush and Alex and all the FauxNews liars that continue to preach that this nothing more than a bad cold. Ask the families of the 81,000+ dead if this is just a bad cold or flu. Ask the many more survivors that were in agony if this was just a nothing-burger. Are people that simple they cannot think for themselves that they would follow a billionaire right to their very own graves because wearing a face covering is now political and weak? Don’t protect yourself if you so desire but don’t come crying and whining when you contract Covid and realize, no it’s not a cold or flu. It’s nasty, and awful, and makes even healthy people fall on their knees. The use of face coverings is showing respect for others, showing compassion and concern for their well-being. By not choosing to wear one, you are essentially saying, “Yeah, I don’t care if you live or die and I’m the one responsible.” It says more about you as a person than your politics. They should allow someone who contracts Covid and can contact trace back to an individual that wasn’t wearing a mask as their infectious point, to sue them for damages, or have them charged with assault. Why not?
Wearing a face covering will save lives. Many of these people screaming the loudest that it’s their body and their life, sure have no problem telling women what to do with their bodies on the regular. Well, how does it feel being told what you can and cannot do with your body? The pro-lifers? Not so much when they chant, death is part of life, or people gotta die to get the economy moving again. What happened to all life is precious? Ahhh, yes, when the shoe is on the other foot, how quickly they turn into hypocrites. I wear a face covering. I socially distance. I sanitize constantly. I do so because I don’t want to bring this back to my elderly parents that live with me. I want them around and I will do everything in my power to protect them from people that have no compassion or concern for their fellow citizens. We used to be the United States of America. We used to care about one another through hard times. We offered support and an extra hand to our neighbors. This happened after 9/11 and it happens after hurricanes and natural disasters. Is it because this is something that travels through man that suddenly no one cares what happens to others? Think the divide was large before? I’m pretty sure the gap will never close again and sadly something as simple as a face covering is enough for someone to kill someone, shoot at people, break arms, or threaten others with violence. A face covering, think about that, a simple ask for respecting others is enough to incite violence and even murder. What has happened to us, not just as warring political factions, but as human beings that we care so little for one another. I just don’t understand it. I don’t.
Well said. Incomprehensible. Where is my country?
Sometimes all you need to understand is what you already know and have expressed . Take care of yourself, the Family, Be vigilant and Keep the Faith.
How many healthy people have you seen falling to their knees due to Covid 19? It is a nice sounding narrative, but at the end, most people afflicted by Covid 19 were people with pre existing health conditions and elderly people. Many people who tested positive had no symptoms at all and didn’t even know they had it. There are way too many unknown factors about Covid 19 to justify the unprecedented responses.
Christopher Lemke says
There you go again. This is a discussion about wearing face masks, not a forum for slamming President Trump and the “deplorables”. You will someday come to realize that Hillary Clinton lost and Donald Trump is President, and will be for the next four years. Many Democrat governors are pursuing a scorched earth policy in the hopes of further damaging the economy. It won’t work because their antics will burn out long before the election.
You have repeated the Democrat talking points very well! Ant the guilt trip? Stop.
Please just get over it and, by the way, publish your real name next time. It is very freeing.
My Grandfather died of the flu – should we have tried to trace that back to someone not wearing a mask and sue them?
CB from PC says
One of my rights is to be free of Coronavirus, or at the very least, mitigate the risk.
I wear a mask.
It is not anyone else’s right to unnecessarily potentially spread, or increase the risk of requiring health care, because they decide not to wear a mask.
And what about communal health with regular vaccines? What about communal health with humans relieving themselves on the side of business and in the bushes. What about the communal health with regards to cell phone use. This is about control, nothing else. Show hard evidence that covering mouth and nose and NOT eyes prevents spread. They keep saying trust the science, but as a scientist myself, I know it is still too early to “trust the science”. I remember distinctly the aids epidemic and how when it started, the “science” was ALL wrong. SCIENCE takes time, and you don’t make decisions based on science until the science is right. Models are notoriously wrong, and nearly every PhD has one of their own…..
Trailer Bob says
Because you cannot spread the virus via your eyes. When you talk, you spread your breath and everything attached to it to others nearby. This doesn’t occur via your eyes, ears, or in most cases even your nose.
So, for all of you who feel stronger by not wearing a mask that is fine with me, as long as you stay at least 10 feet away from me. And if you cannot handle that, I may consider that assaust and teach you the need to wear a mask in another way…
why aren’t restaurant staff required to wear masks? I won’t patronize one who doesn’t.
Honest Truth says
Chief Forte sounds like you aren’t very concerned about peoples well being in Palm Coast. Yes, it should be mandatory to wear masks in public and it has proven to protect yourself and others. What about those 65 and older working with young people that you say can do what they want to wear or not wear.
Funny Chief Forte now that the virus has spread in the West Wing of the White House now the staff are required to wear masks. Why aren’t your listening to the professional medical people saying masks do help keep from spreading the virus.
Just start watching the virus start spreading around Palm Coast and Flagler County, we will come back and ask what you think then.
And, you should just go do your job as a fire chief and stay out of Palm Coast and the Flagler County official’s decisions. Do the job your were hired to do and that isn’t your telling citizens to wear or not wear masks. Is it in your job description to even get involved with the health of our town or country?
Please kindly show me the scientific proof that wearing masks protects people from contracting the virus. I couldn’t find any. What I found is that their is no consensus among scientists at all about that subject. It is all an experiment at this stage. Therefore it should be up to each individual to decide if they wear a mask or not. Just imagine everyone wears masks and they get the virus anyway? Or just imagine you do not wear a mask and help your immune system fight the new intruder? Either way, there is no guarantee which approach works best, and the honest scientists don’t pretend to know all the answers. Because they don’t. This new virus hasn’t been studies sufficiently to make any honest predictions. Now people are getting scared because the number of Covid cases is going up again. What is not being told is much more revealing. The numbers go up because so many more people are being tested. To make the statement of numbers going up a true statement, the number of cases tested needs to remain the same.
If I go into a business and the sign says ‘No Shirt – No Shoes – No Service’, I do not start yelling about my civil rights/liberties! I put on a shirt & shoes and enter. What is the big deal.
The big deal is that each business can require that as their own rules as how they want to do business. It’s an individual decision. The next business can say no shoes or shirts required. It’s up to every individual to deal with those businesses. But as a citizen and as a human you have inherit rights which can not and should not be violated by any governing entity.
Jennifer Barr says
I have the right to life! We have laws to protect us! Examples: You can’t drink or drive. You need vaccinations for your child to enter school! You need to wear a seatbelt! You can’t just murder another human being! So yes, why not make wearing a mask a law, because you don’t ha e the right to expose the most vulnerable to a disease that could kill them! So wear a damn mask and social distance so we can get our country up and running again!
Big Neighbor says
I like the way you think. We can all use some help at looking at this from familiar ground to reach and new level of understanding. We have to wear shirts and shoes to get service. Someone made the determination that was baseline health concern as a control of the environment, a regulation. To conform is to acquire; that’s a market control. You want service, then you have to give up something of yourself, to exchange beyond yourself. You decided into a partnership. We make compromises to our personal freedoms under the guise of civil obedience. The trick is, when we see a violation to this compromise or decide something in the environment has changed that now reverses the necessity of shirt and shoes, say zoning of a restaurant on the river, there are ways to contest the regulation. But it takes access. Without access to make a change, we are forced into civil disobedience. The direct way for access is, like the article implies, ” go to the proprietor of the store, the store manager, and urge them to change their culture and their behavior, allowing people to come in with a mask on. “. Problem is, we’re seeing issues like these being hot beds for confrontation and violence. FACT: People should have access to representation and Government, and now WE, collectively have the policies in commerce and civil regulation domains to control and influence others through culture by making local code enforce restrictions like the new norms. However, these elements of Government have been minimized. OPINION: Because everything is “lean” in business commerce with “just in time inventory” philosophies, there is no place for people in infrastructure to make sure these things get done in a timely, proactive strategy, whether its supplies or reporting early warning about a virus from overseas. FACT: Part of that factor of controlling and influencing others is using social media to divide us. OPINION: I believe local government has the responsibility to influence public norms in behavior by only channel information to the public through responsible sourcing which excludes most social media platforms. We have a new norm in digital culture.
my physician and his staff do not wear masks and say they do no good. I follow his advice. I do carry a mask in my pocket and if the manager of a store were to ask me to put it on I would.(never happened). I am an admitted germaphobe to begin with and dont like people getting near me either and I never ,ever get sick. I drink hot lemon water twice a day , gargle with listerine numerous times a day , wash with hand sanitiser each and every time I get back to my vehicle from a store, wash my hands countless times and at night have a few shots of alcohol . Good hygene is much more important than a mask. One of my friends who I shoot with is also an MD and he basically told me the same things as my regular doctor , and he doesnt wear a mask either.
Iron horse says
Good hygiene is much more important then a mask, I totally agree. People feel a misleading sense of safety wearing a mask, but don’t realize how many times they touch their face to reposition their masks, take it down, put it back up and so on.
Christopher T Lemke says
You are absolutely correct! Common sense like yours and your doctor friend is sadly lacking in life and in some of these comments.
Indicative of the real threat is four leaders in the COVID 19 response testifying from quarantine: Dr. Fauci, Adm Giroir, and the heads of FDA and CDC as well as other senators and the chair of the committee leading the inquiry. If they feel the need to shelter in place with all their knowledge of the science known today about this, I choose to follow their lead. Servicemen and women and health care workers risk their lives for others; we should care enough for others to mitigate the risk where we can.
Keep drinking the koolaid mask wearers, while your at it, try wearing them properly! Sickness and diseases have always been around you, your scared now because someone “told” you should be
For all the blow hard “legends in their own minds” experts here. . . this from the “real” medical experts at the Mayo Clinic:
Can face masks help prevent the spread of coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19)? Yes, face masks combined with other preventive measures, such as frequent hand-washing and social distancing, help slow the spread of the disease.
So why weren’t face masks recommended at the start of the pandemic? At that time, experts didn’t yet know the extent to which people with COVID-19 could spread the virus before symptoms appeared. Nor was it known that some people have COVID-19 but don’t have any symptoms. Both groups can unknowingly spread the virus to others.
These discoveries led the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) to do an about-face on face masks. The CDC updated its guidance to recommend widespread use of simple cloth face coverings to help prevent transmission of COVID-19 by people who have the virus but don’t know it.
Countries that required face masks, testing, isolation and social distancing early in the pandemic seem to have had some success slowing the disease’s spread. Common sense also suggests that some protection is better than none. But wearing a face mask will lose any value unless it’s combined with frequent hand-washing and social distancing.
Be A Patriot, A Good Neighbor, A Good Human Being. . . do try and protect yourself and US ALL the best you can! Practice “Social Distancing”, “Wear a Mask” in public places if you possibly can. It actually is the courageous and SMART thing to do! Karma and judgement is always there! Do you want to be PROUD of how you live your life on our “shared” planet, or do you want to be seen as “FEAR FILLED and SELFISH SCUM”?
For every one of your experts saying they work, there is one saying they don’t. Sorry but the mayo clinic is not the end all beat all source of medicinal information. If you want to wear a mask wear it. But don’t think you can compel others to, you lack that authority
We do not have any evidence yet that the wearing of masks and social distancing has slowed the spread of the disease. We have no indicators what would have happened if we didn’t wear masks and we didn’t use social distancing as a tool to combat the virus. In scientific studies they use the a double blinded approach to test their thesis. Neither group knows which one is getting the medication that is being tested. The same applies to Covid. To claim success in stopping the spread of the disease with a one sided approach is just not convincing in a scientific way. It really doesn’t proof anything at all. However, there have been countries who used a different approach, like Sweden and Japan and their Covid numbers have been no worth than ours.
Steven Gromlovits says
Has anybody ever seen Donald Trump or Dr.Fauchi wearing a mask in meetings with 50 or so unmasked media reporters? Me neither.
Concerned Citizen says
So much contridiction on masking.
When did this get appealed?
876.13 Wearing mask, hood, or other device on public property.—No person or persons shall in this state, while wearing any mask, hood, or device whereby any portion of the face is so hidden, concealed, or covered as to conceal the identity of the wearer, enter upon, or be, or appear upon or within the public property of any municipality or county of the state.
What’s going to happen when banks reopen? You can’t wear a hat or sunglasses. Let alone a mask.
I’ll wear one when needed. But not going to live in one 24/7. And nobody has the right to tell me I need to do otherwise.
So its clear you are trying to make something out of nothing. No where and at no point has anyone ever said to wear a mask 24/7 , only when social distancing isnt possible.
I will remind you there have been 4 deaths in 2020 to Coronavirus in Flagler county. My intent here is not to trivialize 4 lives, but provide a perspective in the numbers that is touching off this reaction. How many of us have been to the grocery store, only to find the mask & glove wearing do-gooders and care more about others group has become too lazy to dispose of their PPE, just dropping it anywhere in the parking lot, on the ground, in a grocery cart they used & were too lazy to push to a common cart collection location. You’re fooling yourself if you think those wearing masks are doing that for anyone other than themselves and their immediate clan.
Understanding that, the nature of exposure & contaminated PPE, all that would happen is a physical transfer of exposed & contaminated waste products. Back to the quarantine, closures and anything else that may or may not have been effective n this fire drill of pandemic. This becomes a matter of anything else that is a toxic dumping in the history of the human race. I recall the 1970’s & beyond, a day where surfing in Daytona Beach, FL barges of trash from the NY/NJ area was being relocated to FL. In that you often found used syringes on the beaches.
This is 2019 in Venice Beach, CA. That waste isn’t your neighbor bellowing their freedom are being infringed, it’s the healthcare community that is supposed to be the one’s that care about the rest of us. Let’s not spin this and point fingers to find loopholes of exclusion. We’re all part of the human race and each of us has a minimum waste footprint we leave on this planet. With o vaccine/cure/pixie dust, the word is no more or less dangerous than it’s ever been. Not being morbid about it. Factually, you are born, you live your life and then you die of something. Along the way any of us are bombarded with bacterias, viruses. Even your dental health issues are a matter of time. So embrace life & live it, there has got to be some realization at some point where a guarantee on life doesn’t happen for anyone. Sharing the planet is the only way it’s going to work, this has reached critical mass, the one’s in denial trying to pocket it all for themselves to leave to the next generation aren’t on board with the program. As bad as the pandemic has been to date,the human race is really in no danger of extinction, the recovery rate > the death toll, that’s without any effective treatments, social distancing can’t be maintained at the individual level even. It hasn’t been, some of it by circumstances, other because someone just flat out didn’t care to social distance. 6 feet became 13 feet, what we knew about social distancing was even wrong.
Question… why so scared now? You pro mask supporters do realize that people have been getting sick all around you, all the time, every year! If not, spoiler alert. Were you people in support of masks this time last year? I doubt it! Yet people were still getting sick then, some worse, and some better than now. Did you sell your vehicles, and all your toys that are polluting the air and not only killing people but the planet as well? Did you get rid of your vehicles when you realize that accidents are killing people? Did you get rid of all your social media accounts and blogs and forums when you realize that predators are out there using it to stalk their prey? Did you get rid of your cell phone when someone tells you that it’s the leading cause of cancer? The answer to these and any question of the like is of course not! Your face masks aren’t going to stop anything! They’re not sanitizing shopping cart handles, door handles, and keypads because you’re breathing on them, they’re sanitizing them because you keep touching them. Your hands are spreading more of this virus than your face, so please by all means, drink the Kool-Aid, wear your face mask, but stay off my ass about not wearing one. I don’t care if you do wear one, and you shouldn’t care if I don’t! You need to get a grip on your paranoid little lives!
Our right to have rights is totally distorted here and grossly abused by certain groups and for political reasons and is shameful as is causing children and adults to die unnecessarily. Starting with the second amendment created by our forefathers when the weapon was a musket and not a machine gun to be used by our military in the battle front and not to hunt and kill humans among us, especially children in schools settings.
Same now with this mask wearing or not, while instigated with the wrong message from the irresponsible bad image at the top. I wear a mask in public inside buildings or crowded parking lots to keep my family, myself and more important my fellow Americans safer. I do not wear it inside my car while travelling alone or with my household relative obviously, for added law enforcement visual security. I reduced my outings just to buy essentials, food, pharma or lawn maintenance supplies so my sod don’t die eaten by bugs, run by weeds or for lack of nutrients. I refuse to shop on any store were the employees do not wear masks…of course I had to go by for toiletries to Walmart and all of them wore mask, except the young guy at the sports department…so didn’t buy a thing there. I guest as he sells guns too “he is allowed to do as he pleases”. The number of this darn Covid new cases detected keep growing as sadly do the deaths at almost or past 87,000 in about only 2 months and that to me is concerning enough to wear a mask in public and stay home in as much as I can and we all often wash hands, especially after being being in public. Unfortunately as far is our family going out to eat is off the chart for us until this pandemic realistically and proven retreats. Those that refuse to wear a mask may end up like one of many but meanwhile help to spread the disease: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52157824. How patriotic is this?
palm coast walmart hasnt sold guns for years,what walmart were you at? I would like to know because the walmarts that do sell guns usually have good deals .I need to spend my stimulis money on something fun!
Why is it only the Doctors have the N95 mask? If it’s good enough for the Doctors it’s good enough for me…So N95 masks should be issued to every citizen. No sending them overseas.
Before he embraced masks for all, Fauci smugly dismissed the measure in March during a “60 Minutes” interview because it would “make people ‘feel’ a little bit better, and it might even block a droplet, but it’s not providing the perfect protection people think that it is.” Now, he says, face coverings must be a “should be a very regular part” of our daily lives.
Dutiful reporters ignore the flip-flop, slavishly acting as stenographers for Fauci and the rest of the dishonest “deep state.” “Masks are here to stay,” The Washington Post Lifestyle section chirped last week. To which I say: I ain’t buy-in it!
Until It's Safe says
FACT – CDC estimates tell us that during the 2017-18 and 2018-19 FLU seasons (combined) 95,000 Americans were killed by the FLU and 800,000 were hospitalized by the FLU. The FLU being H1N1. Remember? From 2009? The one we’ve had a vaccine for since about 2010? 95,000 killed by the FLU. Google it.
FACT – (from fda.gov) The ‘N95’ designation means that when subjected to careful testing, the RESPIRATOR blocks at least 95 percent of very small (0.3 micron) test particles. If properly fitted, the filtration capabilities of N95 RESPIRATOR exceed those of face masks. However, even a properly fitted N95 RESPIRATOR does not completely eliminate the risk of illness or death. (EMPHASIS ADDED BY ME).
QUESTION – If a properly fitted RISPIRATOR is 95% effective what is the effectiveness of an N95 or N98 mask (let alone a cloth face covering)?
QUESTION – Are we going to die?
PCNY GUY says
When did the Fire Chief become an expert on the Virus?? I think he should stick to taking care of the 2 fires a month you have over there in PC. But then again you have a Deputy Chief, 3 Battalion Chiefs and 3 Captains to handle that.
Common Sense Citizen of Palm Coast says
Masks/Gloves vs. Death. Easy choice for me. I’m not a person who is a “chicken little”, however, my wife is a published and esteemed scientist who was ahead of tracking this pandemic and warned our community of the dangers of this virus. She has diabetes type 2, heart disease, COPD/breathing issues and is a senior citizen. She is an Anatomy and Physiology specialist and she has researched this issue extensively. Realize this is a hardship for many of the unemployed and those with monetary problems, but losing your life is a much bigger issue for family and friends. Stay positive and utilize all of the local and State services.
Keep Safe Everyone!
Thank you to Palmcoaster and ALL true courageous Patriots who help to protect us all by wearing masks.
To the still uneducated and mindless FOX CULT . . . this virus is VERY HIGHLY CONTAGIOUS! Comparing the risks involved to other non-contagious dangers is simply asinine!
This virus is much more highly fatal than the Flu and creates great suffering for the survivors, who may. . . have PERMANENT physical damage.
To those who still refuse to protect us all by “Social Distancing” and “Wearing Masks” in crowded public spaces. . . “Selfish Fear Filled Scum” it is then! Please, just stay completely away from me and mine.
CB from PC says
All these “no one tells me what to do voices”. Must have been beaten silly by the Nuns as kids.
GILEAD, THE MANUFACTURER OF REMDEZIMIR, A POSSIBLE COVID REMEDY, WILL DONATE SOME OF THEIR PRODUCT. HOWEVER, TO MAKE PRODUCTION DOABLE, THE TENTATIVE PRICE MAY BE $4500.00!…. SHOULD WE ALL CONSIDER WEARING..MASKS??
Well I ‘m sure a red MAGA hat is sufficient protection .
Just Wear your MAGA hats Palmcoasters that will protect you most effectively, or maybe not so much.
What a bunch of selfish D-bags
Sheila Zinkerman says
Why You Should Wear a Mask: Take the Urine Test:
Shelia Zinkerman. . . LOVE IT! Thanks!
Fauci and Brix DO now wear masks. . . even while with trump who is very displeased with them.
Regarding why “your” lord trump doesn’t wear a mask. . . I’m guessing he wouldn’t want to tarnish his horrific track record by setting any kind of good example or appearing anything close to presidential. His crimes against humanity continue!
Actually, he decided to promote common sense. If you want to wear a mask, fine, go ahead, but don’t dictate to me
Same dingbats squawking about making a LAW that kids have to pull up their pants are now spouting about liberty over what they wear. Typical conservative hypocrisy.
Fauci and Birx are NOW wearing masks to prevent our POTUS from contacting Covid-19 so he can continue to be OUR president for the next 5 years. After all, how many of YOU people have spouted off that masks do not protect the wearer from getting Covid-19, it’s to protect others when you are Covid-19 symptomatic. Trump doesn’t wear one as he gets tested daily if not more. He has worn them in public places where he is in close proximity to others but removes it when he is a sufficient distance away form others. He has done that solely because of people like you who ridicule him for anything and everything. Get OFF his case. He’s attempting to save peoples lives regardless of your petty remarks.
Jill webster says
To Mr. Hanson, who thinks people should stay home if the don’t want to wear masks.
You stay home Mr. Hanson so you don’t pass the virus on to me.
So, if all of us refusing to wear masks are also refusing to get tested and refusing to get vaccinated, where are all the positive tests coming from, where are the reactions to the vaccine coming from ? That’s right, it’s all coming from the sheep that follow every dictate from a 2 bit, brainless bureaucrat… experts indeed. If that idiot fauci tells you in order to slow the spread of Wuhan flu that you have to insert your index finger in your rectum when you go out in public, are you gonna do that too ?