Carl Cote was updating the Palm Coast City Council on the latest options to address the eternal complaints of residents around Florida Park Drive when Mayor Milissa Holland almost snapped.
“Who said that was an option? I’m just curious,” the mayor said, referring to one of three options Cote was listing: do nothing until the road traffic’s grade drops below a C, meaning that it would be closer to a failing roadway. “No action,” however, is not the sort of plan this council likes to be associated with. “Did staff just put that in there because they felt it was appropriate?” the mayor asked.
“That was the previous solution, that previous traffic engineer,” said Cote, the construction manager who, days before City Manager Matt Morton began his tenure, was named director of the newly created Stormwater and Engineering Department. The 11th-hour appointment, by then-Interim Manager Beau Falgout, rankled some council members. Cote’s standing has not necessarily risen with his title since.
“I’m just saying we have a whole new conversation going on, brand new council, I’ve been there since 2016, put it in the strategic plan, figure out some solution for Florida Park Drive,” Holland said, “I’m not interested in hearing what former councils did in 2015. So, again, we asked you to come with some solutions, so why would you put in there as an option?”
“It meets our standard, city council standard level of service,” Cote said.
“That’s frustrating,” Holland said. “I’m just going to say that. That’s really frustrating. I mean, just because it meets it, this is a strategic action item of this council, that is not OK. That is very frustrating.” Cote said he wasn’t saying it as a recommendation, just an option. But Holland insisted that she was looking for “active solutions.”
“It’s fine to look at the history of how many times this roadway’s been looked at,” Holland said, “we understand it’s a complicated issue. But what I was hoping for was not have an option thrown out there saying, let’s just wait, kick the can down the road, and when it gets to Level C, then we’ll actually do something. That’s not an option for me.”
“In fairness to staff,” council member Bob Cuff, who has often taken on the role of a chicane when council discussions heat up, said, “I get harangued by citizens all the time that say, why are you doing this, why are you doing that, just don’t do anything, there isn’t a problem.’ I agree with you, clearly we get told every single council meeting, workshop, at business meetings, by a small group of citizens that there is a big problem on Florida Park Drive. So I certainly am in favor of looking at what our options are. But, at the end of the day, if we hold these neighborhood meetings for instance, that’s part of this new study, and 500 residents that commute on Florida Park Drive every day show up and threaten a lawsuit if we put speed tables or chicanes or cobblestone paving on Florida Park Drive, and we still have five residents saying do something, do something, do something–I don’t want to prejudge anything. I would love to find a solution that makes everybody happy. But again, to be fair to the staff and prior councils, this was only three and a half, four years ago. I agree with you it’s frustrating to be told that the best option is to do nothing other than what we’re already doing, and I’m not saying that’s what we ought to do, but–” He later said it was more a matter of “bad optics than a failure on the part of staff.”
Holland said the frustration is not reckoning with the known history, but the idea of doing nothing. “I don’t sit up here and claim to know the solution,” she said, but ideas such as traffic-calming systems or other “creative” alternatives might well be explored, if only to improve the residents’ quality of life.
Eddie Branquinho, one of the newer council members, felt the same way. “Enough is enough,” he said.
“Is that the end of your presentation?” Holland asked Cote, as if to suggest that it ought to be. Cote mentioned reduction of the speed limit from 30 or 35, or restricting truck traffic. Holland, who uses the road, says she’s not interested in speed limit changes so much as calming devices. Cote himself said reducing truck traffic would be “very, very difficult.” But Holland is prepared to send individual letters to businesses to cooperate and perhaps use alternate routes for their truck traffic, an idea that drew Cuff’s support.
R. Sans Lassiter, president of the Lassiter Transportation Group, one of the city’s consultants who’s worked on Florida Park Drive, said the road was poorly designed. But that was ITT’s problem. (ITT developed Palm Coast before it was incorporated in 1999.) He talked about traffic calming devices such as roundabouts, dead-ending the road, narrowing the road in certain places with landscaping, adding small medians (not a feasible option on narrow Florida Park Drive). Landscaping caught Holland’s attention. “We landscape every road in this community. Why we don’t focus on this road escapes me,” she said. “It certainly doesn’t represent what Palm Coast represents.”
“Magically airlift this road and take it away from all of us, that’s not going to happen,” Holland said. She directed Morton to come up with fresher and seemingly greener solutions.
“It is only a 60-foot right of way, it’s very limited, between the swales, the sidewalk and the roadway there’s not much room to add any landscaping,” Cote said. “However we could possibly come up with some solutions for residents to add landscaping on their properties. So we’re going to look into these options, maybe at a couple of intersections.”
The city has also been considering buying and installing air sensors in two locations along Florida Park Drive, for around $25,000. That option is still on the table.
Robby says
What’s an air sensor and what do they do??
David S. says
What a friggen joke………
Dave says
The perfect resolution to a non problem is a non solution. The only problem we have with Florida Park Drive is the residents that complain about a poor investment they made on a busy road. There is no problem on Florida Park Drive.
The Truth says
The City of Palm Coast answer to everything: add landscaping.
This is absolutely ridiculous.
Bible Bill says
Do like wise King Solomon, cut the road in half!
Layla says
The cheapest way to handle this is to install stop signs on the corners, invest in some concrete and put in speed bumps. Problem solved.
Damien says
I live in F and Drive on Florida Park every day. There are no problems that need addressing. Now, Old Kings intersection with Palm Coast Parkway… This is pure idiocy. You have 3 lanes.the right and center lanes are for making right hand turns which can be done with a red light, even a red arrow you can make a right. Left lane is combined straight South traffic down old kings or left to head East on PCPkwy. the green light only lets 4 or 5 cars through IF everyone is paying attention. Why can’t we go straight through in the center lane like EVERY OTHER GOD DAMNED INTERSECTION IN THE WORLD? Seriously. What Ass clown decided this traffic pattern? Cars backed up in Left lane back to Dunkin Donuts some mornings; it takes longer to get through this one intersection than it takes me to get to Rimfire elementary. You want to get your panties up in a wad Council? Try getting straight through that intersection at 8:30-9am some morning. Heres a hint: Let the green go a lil’ bit longer than 5 cars per cycle! Or open center lane to straight through traffic. Sheesh. Like its MY job to figure this stuff out.
Mitch says
8,000 cars per day & 565 trucks per day (3+ Million vehicles per year) – there is no escaping the fumes and noise – most complaints to do nothing comes from drivers that dump their fumes and noise in not-their-neighborhood. Yes, they don’t mind destroying someone else’s neighborhood, but don’t touch their neighborhood . They don’t care how residents health is harmed. Not even children’s health whose bedrooms are 60 feet from the roadway, where fumes & noise enter their rooms daily. Drivers convenience to use the road has a higher priority than protecting the health of any child that lives there. Protecting children over convenience for drivers – the City got it right.
palmcoaster says
To those above that do not live in Florida Park Drive just don’t know what mayhem these residents have with the noise, rattling, emissions and speed hazards these residences road front are enduring since 2008. No these residents didn’t buy cheap, they didn’t and now they can’t sell without even taking a huge financial loss. Their quality of life forever taken away from them by over 8,500 vehicles a day many being gasoline or liquefied gas tank truck transports, heavy loaded Fed Exp, Beverage, construction or concrete transport semis, etc. Anyone opposing the Florida Park Drive residents complaints sure do not experience the losses taken by over 2 miles of residents and many in the adjacent roads. What is going to take for Mr. Cote to see that maybe sooner or later one of those big tank trucks rushing thru FPD will crash and create a deadly inferno for hundreds of residents? We hardly see anyone walking their dogs or their children playing in front of those houses just take a wild guess why? If we do not resolve the problem of Florida Park Drive now and city staff like Mr. Cote keeps ignoring it, then any other originally residential road designed by now unjustified blamed ITT, will become a FPD, Example like Cimmaron now were an owner got her pet run over by one of many daily speeders that didn’t stop or Club House Drive were young drivers pass on the double yellow line while one with the turning light on try to maker a left or right turn. Or Cooper and Casper where at 30 PMH posted, some neighbors with babies are selling and moving to the cull de sacs to keep their children safe. Then we have all these one block total length streets off Club House Drive after Carlson Lane all those have a 30 MPH speed Cameo, Carol to Campbell in one short block street that ends in the main canal, 30 MPH? Who was the brain traffic engineer designating that? Palm Coast is a growing city open to development but our comprehensive plan, (Mr Cotes, and Councilman Cuff) reads that growth should not hinder or negatively affect the quality of life of the existing residents,” I will add in favor of some developers”. Next some of many Florida Park Drive residents quotes : “The traffic has so increased that has become intolerable and a health hazard. Specially commercial vehicles”, “We feel your pain Steven Carr as my wife and I moved away of FPD in 2014 , We will never recover the financial loss we took in in the sale of our beloved home of so many years”.
Lets do not forget that these were not the promises made to these residents when we all voted for incorporation in 1999. Lets do not forget also that these residents, maybe represented by 4 or 5 able to attend the council meetings (like Councilman Cuff undermined forgetting that he should represent the constituents that elected him and not city staff) and that the residents of FPD that as Cuff says do not attend the meetings, but I can reassure you Mr, Cuff that they vote and the last city election result showed proof of it.
Hmmm says
STOP ALL THE WHINING!!! Fl Pk Dr has ALWAYS been the main road in that area. Always. Whose fault is it that people chose to either buy a house there and/or move into one? Its not a “cut thru” or a “shortcut”, its the way home for residents that live there. Its funny to me that people complain about traffic when they live on the main road. And sad that its actually getting entertained by officials.
Agkistrodon says
Sorry to burst the bubble, But Palm Coast Roads were NOT designed for the amount of traffic on them. You can force a square peg all you like, but I tell you it will NOT go into a round hole, unless you cut the corners.
Optimist says
Here’s a solution, tell everyone on Florida Park drive that can’t habdle the traffic, to buy a home on a cul-de-sac… elsewhere. Part of old poorly planned towns includes the absolute fact that a residential street will become a major thoroughfare. One “potential way to ease” would be a fast travel from the parkway onto a widened Old Kings, with turn lanes into neighborhoods and a logistically impossible fast travel to sailboat country. Lol, good luck palm coast. You’re gonna need it.
Doug says
With all the taxpayer money wasted in Flagler County…hell, they should build new roadways just for the “landscaping trucks”. Problem solved with new infrastructure! What’s a few more million dollars or Bond referendums?
atilla says
Make it one way.north to south.
Mary Kay Hayward says
FACTS:
1. The results of the traffic count performed last week continue to reveal that >8,000 vehicles travel on FPD DAILY. For example:
8,000 counted vehicles Divided by hours of travel time Vehicles per Minute
8000 8000/20=400 6.7
8000 88000/16=500 8.3
My security camera documents that during daytime hours of 9 to 5, on average the total time that no vehicles pass in front on my home is……………………………….17 SECONDS. That does not mean per vehicle – it means that 20 vehicles can easily pass my front door in 30 seconds. Other times it may be one huge tractor trailer car carriers or flammable gas carrier or freight container carrier will pass by in 3 seconds, then nothing for a maximum of 17 seconds, then 20 vehicles. You may not personally feel this is a problem, but numbers don’t lie; it is a problem.
2. Cut-through traffic – While there is no recognized precise definition that could be found on the FDOT or USDOT websites, generally accepted definition is: if the driver’s destination is not on or directly connected (meaning there is no other roadway to get to that destination) the driver IS cutting through or is considered through traffic.
When our home was purchased, we recognized that FPD would service all of the homes east of FPD (no other road for travel whatsoever); that FPD would service at least half of the residents west and connected to FPD; that FPD would service the upper neighborhoods of the “C” section and North “F” sections; that FPD drive has the only entrance to Holland Memorial Park and a convenient entrance to Island Walk. All of this – ACCEPTED. We understood it would be a busy street. However, did the notion that FPD residents would also be burdened with all of the contractors who service these areas would have entitlement to use this residential neighborhood as their PRIMARY route for delivery and/or services? NO. Or that our fair City would allow night deliveries of food and beverage tractor trailers to Publix to utilize FPD and disturb the tax-paying residents’ sleep? NO. Have we begun to realize that ALL of the major construction projects for the Portuguese American Club, Channelside, Palm Harbor Parkway improvements, Sabal Palms, Conservatory, Cimarron basin, future Old Kings Road N construction, etc. have used/will use FPD for the land clearing heavy equipment, cement/asphalt deliveries, grading equipment, Builder’s First Source, Cemex and all other such Bunnell businesses? YES. Will we stand for this? NO. No one could possibly understand this traffic until they are stationary in it.
According to the Flagler County Property Appraiser, there are approximately 554 residential homes directly on FPD and east of FPD that must travel this roadway. Yes, we are all part of the traffic numbers. Additionally, there are approximately 2,116 residential properties west of FPD that connect to FPD. This does not include those neighborhoods not connected to FPD. I personally do not begrudge those in the upper neighborhoods who use FPD. If I lived there and had been using this route, I would not want to lose it either. BUT, with these number continually increasing as the City continues to approve project such as the retail at the Conservatory, more and more employees/service deliveries/customers of these new builds will come onto FPD. These new builds must include this faction when conducting their traffic analyses. If not, all of northern sections will lose this connectivity convenience eventually. We will no longer tolerate the burden of the construction and ancillary traffic of this project nor any other project. The “whining” will continue. If things are not put into check, chaos will reign. Stop the truck and heavy-weight traffic. Then, let’s see how it pans out, and take it from that fresh starting point. The actual traffic projections are incalculable.
3. The speeding is NOT controlled by FCSO. In the entire year of 2018, FCSO issued 57 Uniform Traffic Citation (not all for speeding) related to FPD. How many speeding citations were actually on FPD? 5, as in F-I-V-E. All of the others were at the intersections of PHP or PCP, not from monitoring FPD. Out of more than 2,920,000 (8000 x 365) vehicles traveling directly on FPD, five speeding tickets were issued. ‘Nuf said.
4. ‘Your property values are lower and that’s why you bought there. Stop complaining. You get what you pay for.’ Shall I elaborate and insert a tale on the comparison of tax values for FPD properties that are comparable to a building/lot not dealing with 8000 vehicles per day? Later.
5. Why do we stay? Why not, ‘If you don’t like the traffic, leave?’ I love my home. I have invested blood, sweat, tears and lots of money in making it my home. I have fantastic neighbors; THEY ARE GOOD PEOPLE just like you who simply want to live their lives in some semblance of quiet enjoyment. I love the sunrises that stream into my kitchen. I love Holland Memorial Park, Island Walk, Long Creek Nature Preserve and the many conveniences Palm Harbor has to offer. I believe this neighborhood can be a happy place that we share with our neighbors and is worth fighting for.
A few days ago as I was backing out of my driveway, a northbound car was traveler example #1; ‘No, don’t do it….don’t you dare’ and sped up DRAMATICALLY as to not give me a break. Followed by example #2; complete oblivion to my existence. Then there was example #3 who slowed down and let me out. I waved and thanked that person then, and I thank her now. Sometimes it just takes a little kindness, respect, courtesy, and plain common decency to make a day brighter.
Would you be one to help us? Would you be one to check your GPS and see that going OKR or PHP would actually save you time? Would you be one to please slow down? There is a stop sign or a red light at either end of FPD. Even if you catch the green light at PCP, no matter what, you will have to stop, so why the rush? Just because you can? The faster you travel, the louder the “whoosh” and “clunk” as you hit the poorly engineered sewer covers, and the more pollution you omit. Just this morning I had the unfortunate task of delivering my neighbors’ dead pet which my son picked up off the road last night and put in a box. You know it’s true….if a pet wants to dig or climb out of a fully fenced back yard, they find the opportunity and means to do so. This family pet belonged to children. Children also have the ability to get out. PLEASE slow down.
Signed,
Not Going Away
Born and Raised Here says
Make it a toll road.
palmcoaster says
Thank you Mary Kay for the realistic exposure of what the residents and adjacent streets to Florida Park Drive endure daily. In 2015 then council without droves attending the meeting and requesting it, council and Netts decided to just close permanently Forest Grove into Palm Harbor Parkway. Watch the 2015 meeting video minute 48,22 were is announced the closure of Forest Grove into Palm Harbor Parkway to traffic. That was agenda item 7 and No 0ne absolutely was present that requested if so, that closure. https://www.palmcoastgov.com/agendas/city-council/meeting/3754/city-council?video=true
In comparison 4-5 of us consistently representing the affected Florida Park Drive frustrated residents that have been requesting at least to stop the pass thru commercial traffic using FPD since 2008 to no avail.
I believe that with the traffic prevented to use Forest Grove traveling north or south off Palm Harbor Parkway now someway that traffic is pushed to stay on Palm Harbor Parkway into Florida Park Drive instead adding to the mayhem for residents.Then in 2015 Steven Carr already questioning the issues about FPD something Councilman Cuff should take in consideration and properly support.
Mayor Holland in the last workshop meeting finally recognized that Florida Park Drive does not conform at all with the general appearance of Palm Coast roads totally opposing the lack of solutions presented by staff Carl Cote for the residents request. We hope our mayor and council majority (because looks like Cuff is too busy defending staff to support the residents on his district…) they majority will at least agree to divert the commercial thru traffic away from FPD by signage of “No Thru Trucks/ Vehicles Road” and have our Sheriff traffic unit to enforce it. Why Mr. Cote and consultant Lassiter opposed to reducing the thru commercial semis using FPD? Why is Cuff worried about the city being sued if soft bumps to calm traffic will be installed…Where the heck ever that has taking place in Florida. Anyone suing the government over increasing the safety in a residential road. Was Palm Coast sued when in 2015 they closed Forest Grove into Palm Harbor Parkway creating a big inconvenience for traffic?
sadeq says
Palm Coast Roads were not designed for a lot of traffic on them, the solution is to make it one way.